Round length and challenge

[Ragnarok1775]

I remember seeing a side discussion related to this a few weeks ago, maybe on the main PR forums.

It really seems like once the server is reasonably populated, we pretty much steamroll through the map. Yeah there will be setbacks here and there, even the loss of a full chopper, but it feels like there's not as much of a struggle as long as we have people and some of them know what they're doing. Fully populated, it doesn't even seem to matter if they're good or not.

So we end up running through a map pretty quickly it seems, a lot faster than deployment or even coop back in the day. Obviously there's some limitations because bots will never be as sneaky and creative as human players. I admit I haven't had much experience with the new AI changes but I can't say I noticed much of a difference.

Rounds seem to end pretty quick, I'm sure there is someone out there who'll agree with me that it's not quite as fun when you just steamroll through the map with token resistance. I don't know what can really be done or any ideas to throw out there since I'm not on the admin side and the devs seem to be pretty strict about how servers are run.

[=VG= m823us]

It is true that some periods of time during the day, no matter the maps we are able to push our way through.  Hence this is one of the reasons why some map changes and coop changes are being done, @=VG= TEDF is currently working his way though the maps and twerking them so that there is a balance.  But we have to remember that the server population as a whole is declining in numbers, I am not going to lie.  We will always have some maps that are easy *cough Kashan, khamisiyah...* that are asset heavy and easy.  One of the great jobs of admin is to gauge how the players are doing with the maps  and adjust as accordingly.  

Something that I have tried lately is using a new kit or following someone else or changing a new path to see how the bots act.  I know several players that have scripts on how to play the maps and what wins, it is a matter of changing these tactics to make something new.  Maybe try a new asset that you are not proficient with or reduce the amount of times you die per round.  Maybe don't have any kills at all.  

We do have some challenging maps out there, and unfortunately they are not played enough since we don't have the amount of people at times to win.  You can not win Charlies Point with poor trans, or win Yamalia with poor APC squads.  Something that I have always found for a difficult map is Iron Ridge.  If you can pro this map, in less than a half hour you are a PR god.  

[Ragnarok1775]

Kashan etc are definitely quickies on a populated server, but I can remember a time years ago where we fought for every inch like it was Asad Khal. Speaking of, Hamas was at the gates of main and we beat them back and capped every flag with only six of us once, it was hell but it was a lot of fun and a lot of adrenaline.

Like you, I like to do things outside of the box and differently, I often even forego trans many times and move on foot or with light vehicles. Unfortunately when we're packed people will usually just take the path of least resistance instead of trying something new.

Last I remember, and it's been several years, AI skill was set to 90 here and it goes by increments of 10. 100 is absolutely insane, am I correct that there's no way to set AI to 95 or something else in between?

Edit: what would AI actually influence anyway? Just basic skills like accuracy, reaction speed?

[=VG= m823us]

We currently have the BOT AI set to 91-93 depending on the server group and the day.  @=VG= TEDF is working diligently on having tweaks so that bot difficulty is slightly increased and customized to make it a challenge.  I do not remember a lot of games that were difficult to play, but one of them happened today and I enjoyed it.  It was Operation Soul Rebel and we had to run next map because the server pop just could not handle the map with the increase of foliage.  What are some maps that are struggles at the moment for you?

 

[Ragnarok1775]

21 minutes ago, =VG= m823us said:

We currently have the BOT AI set to 91-93 depending on the server group and the day.  @=VG= TEDF is working diligently on having tweaks so that bot difficulty is slightly increased and customized to make it a challenge.  I do not remember a lot of games that were difficult to play, but one of them happened today and I enjoyed it.  It was Operation Soul Rebel and we had to run next map because the server pop just could not handle the map with the increase of foliage.  What are some maps that are struggles at the moment for you?

 

Now that you put me on the spot, I'm not really sure but going forward I will try to take some handwritten notes about what maps are too easy/hard under what conditions. I can tell you for sure that Kashan and Khami are too easy under a normal population. If we're down to like 5-6 people of course, nothing is particularly easy.

[Double_13]

Well i can 100% agree with you that the maps are too easy especially when the server is full.

The reason these maps are easy are due to the method how they are played. if you wish to make Kashan,Bamyan,Khami,Silenteagle,burningsands, etc hard do not use the tanks to kill the enemy armour but try doing it with defending fobs on the flags. I am not going into the opness of the oneman tank as this is already clear.

Several other issues currently cause the maps to become boring and unplayable in several situations.

Ill start with the camping behaviour of regular players/admins that cant seem to get enough of it. Almost all the maps above are played using the exact same method. The tank or heavy assets get crewed by skilled players that sit on their designated spot far away and shoot the convoy leaving main. Yes i can hear you saying isn't this baseraping? Well yes. But the reason we don't really do anything about it is because warning the people will only provoke more problems. 

But there is a reason why people do this.

If you play any of those maps on local and switch to opfor side you can see their is nothing spawning on the first flags. This basically means that the bots all spawned in main and are crewing the assets. Because people do not wish to wait for cap they push as far as possible to get those kills first. Its exactly this problem of bots wrongly spawning that causes the map been easy as you can cap the flag without resistance and push further in the map. 

Regulars make an bad example by doing this and others copy the method.

At the moment we have several admins/players that enjoy camping on the hills but if its within the rules its their right. However, an admin/regularplayer should be an example for other people. If you in a tank with Double and you see where Double parks his tanks and stacks 200 kills in the round you going to do the exact same thing yourself. In result you show this to others that do the same and so on. This describes why its hard to warn people as if the rule would be enforced to to shoot at main on 11:00 ZULU and the same map is played on 14:00 ZULU still half the server would be camping on the same spot as other new people do this similar tactic. This results in the situation that If Double is online i cant sit on the hill and when Double is not online i can sit on the hill. (this counts not only for the maps listed but also other maps where people camp forward flags)

The last and maybe the other key important factor. No Coop

Coop stands for Cooperation that would suggest that people are cooperating together to achieve a common goal. However due to whats above the maps are more like SOLOOP (solo operation). This again mainly focuses to the regular players/admins and not that 1 dude that does not have a mic an wanders away. 
Yes we can always give exceptions to whats said as "well we play in squads and my squad ...." but i am talking in overall perspective. I do my own squadleading so I can hear whats going on an squad chat and its ......................... (nothing). Simmilar in asset squads its often ............. (nothing). and maybe a shouting from i need a logi. Yes we could have rounds i dont have to talk to Hater as he knows what he is doing and talks when needed, but the other 5 squads just wander about.

Within asset squads it becomes even better. People dont talk at all just drive around themselfs and GG. 

The bias for cooperation is so low that the following happens nearly every round. `

(regular dies and respawns in main)
(random asks: dude hey can you gun for me)
(regular answers: nah man i am waithing for my oneman tank to respawn)
(7 min later tank spawns regular drives away and the other guy still stuck in main has no gunner)
(5 min later other guy joins squad and drives with the random for 2 min and round is over)

this should really become an bannable offence as you not willing to cooperate but just want to play hanssolo rather then a team.

 

These issues above are what causes the bot difficulty to be set so high. the 400m RPG is so that it might potentially has a change to kill the camping dudes on the hill.

If you wish to make the maps harder you need to change the mentality of the people that they wish to make the map fun.
Start with removing gametracker scoreboard as this is the main focus for most of the regulars to stack the points.
Start with addressing admins that their camping behaviour is not correct and start punishing others so that the mentality of camping gets removed
Gain a common goal to have fun in the maps and that your Topsquad is not important. (some maps are perfect to play even with a full server if you would wait 4 min and get the bots pushed up in the maps.) 

These changes can be applied without modifying any server file. The maps can still be playable on low population as then you use the onemans but when reasonably full you simply not use them and cooperate with someone else.

As i mentioned once in a comment with fastjack delaying assets or increasing the spawn times on them does not affect the server. Its as its named just an delay of the potential camping. this delay will result in people waiting in main therefor they do not contribute to the game. Imagine xianshang/khami/kashan with all tanks and apc been delayed. that would be 16 people waiting in main for 10 min rather then pushing up helping out and fall back 8 min later like in deployment people in coop just wait. 

I would still suggest the NO PROS AS ASSET HOES Wednesday weekly event in where every regular player is banned from using tanks/apc/cas/ifv and just finish the maps with inf, crates and teamwork. I can tell you, playing kashan without assets is a whole different battle and a lot lot more fun. 

If people dont like it then they can come back the next day and use the assets. I think that as veterans gaming we should promote such an event as it focuses on people working together and have fun as a whole. 

[=VG= Kavelenko]

I don't understand what the fuss is about. VG is the most populated COOP server there is, and with herd mentality that's the number one reason why players are attracted to the server.  If you bring in anymore rules you're likely to reduce the server population even further, whats the point of that? We have specialist events for the die-hards and those who want a challenge, but some players just want to fly something and blow something else up or rack up kills for cheap thrills. So what? Leave em alone I say, if they're having fun why not?

Sure you can encourage team-work where possible but blatantly telling people to "Hey get off that hill" is ridiculous and too much like a police state.

I'm bloody sure I wouldn't want to play PR with those rules in place.

[Double_13]

Its not the people camping on the hill and yelling them to get off its what they impact to the rest of the playerbase.

I can agree that sometimes it can be fun camping on the hill and dont do jack shit and just pew pew. But the method and way people play now has nothing to do with teamwork. 

The issues posted above are known and some are even against the rules

To sum the rules

 

Quote

 

7. Baserape

Baserape is the act of assaulting flags in an incorrect order. Including:

• Skipping 2 or more flags
• Attacking the enemy main base before cappable/attacking uncappable main
• Destroying enemy reinforcement routes (Bridges/Razorwire).
• Laying mines at enemy vehicle spawns.

Skipping 1 flag is allowed for strategical purposes. If no progress is being made you may be ordered to fall back.

 

 

Skipping 2 flags should also include shooting PAST IT Yes the tanks on kashan are not pushed past the flags but they shoot targets that are moving to a flag 3 flags ahead and basically into the main. 

Kashan Hill (7.1 7.2) 
Khami Cas (7.1 7.2 7.3)
Burning sands bridge camp (7.1 7.2)
Bamyan (7.1 7.2) Plus shooting idle assets in main
Mutra docks Tow (7.1 7.2)
Beirut Cas (7.1 7.2)
Beirut tank (7.1 7.2)
kozelsk alt (7.1 7.2 7.3)
Silent std tank rush (7.1 7.2)
bijar std tank rush (7.1) technically also baserape as its convoy shooting
bijar alt tow on hill (7.1 7.2)

I can keep going but it should be clear that all these things are in violation of the rules. However admins do it themselfs and promote doing it. I honestly could not care if they stack the kills but currently they violate the rules what results in making the maps as they are now. And as the admin does it so will the others.

Like i said the main issue is due to the broken map that causes the people to skip the flags in the first place. If khami had bots spawning on chem the tanks wouldn't roll out so cas cant camp and tanks dont have to push forward to kill
However due to the maps been broken people learned themselfs O nothing spawns at this or this flag better rush forward so i can shoot the convoy 4 flags ahead before someone else does it. Because of this it results in the hillcamping we see now rendering nearly 80% of the map unplayed as the bots do not even have a change to reach the positions. As we can not fix the broken maps ourselves because we simply are not allowed to, it is requested that admins would start following the rules and quit their rule breaking and camping behaviour and start playing as it suppose to be.

I did not request any special rules of you cant sit on the hill or do that. i just request admins to follow the dam rules so others can also be enforced following them. 

It is sad to see that when you join the map at start the admins are often the first people to claim all the oneman assets while they are the once with functioning mics and should be trying to cooperate with each other. Yes its their own choice but like i mentioned it came to the point where people rather wait 10 min in main for their own asset to spawn then to cooperate with someone else already waiting in main for 5 min. This is the way we are heading right now.

And again its not them crewing the assets or taking the onemans thats the problem. Its them breaking the rules and pushing ahead to stack kills in a method that violates the rules thats the problem.

I would suggest we have an auto revive scrip so we can remove the requirement of teamwork of a medic, this so you can heal and revive yourself as this basically is the mentality seen now on the server. ME MYSELF AND MY I. 

 

This rulebreaking behaviour that is equal to the hugescale camping is what i want to get changed .Camping on that hill /bridge is not the problem if it would be the actual objective but now the failures of the maps that the bots are only able to spawn in main is abused to where the other 34 people on the server have nothing and i mean nothing to do other than stand in a cap circle as other break the rules. Why are INF maps the only fun maps? exactly because they often do not provide the ability to rape main as its closequarters. 

I would love to play khami/kashan but the issue now is that when I set the map the people not in the assets have nothing to do then walk A to B to C and maybe make 2 kills. The best rounds played on bamyan where because I as tanksquad got all the tanks to fallback to rearm and leave the INF alone to coop with the armour until a combined push could be made. No camping on the hills resulted in no baserape in more coordination and in more fun for everybody. We could have finished the map 50 mins earlyer by just standing on the hill picking off everything but this leaves nothing for the rest.

Tanks should be support for troops and not the only attacker as they are now. 

 

And we have to go to it one more time. If the people would not camp on the hill the bot accuracy settings could be lowered significantly to reasonable levels in where INF has a fun fight VS them. If the settings are lowered the bots might gain better tactical advantage as no longer are all the AI settings overwritten as they are now.

So yea NO special rules just follow the current once

[ranger_12]

12 hours ago, =VG= Double_13 said:

The tank or heavy assets get crewed by skilled players that sit on their designated spot far away and shoot the convoy leaving main.

This peopls are not skilled! skilled ppls are those who risk thier assets to go throu dangerous flags and support the infantry no matter the setuation is dangerous.  i call those ppls who camp and shoot the bots from long distance '' Cheaters '' looking for points thats all.

some of them don't even revive a fallen friend 1 m near them and they prefer keep using that machine gun and pew pew pew ... wow  you are a great one you have 200 kills  ... they don't cover/ they don't corporate/ they don't listen / they don't support. all they care about is POINTS AND KILLS. don't forget that games was made for fun not glory  ...

[Jersans]

Here we go again. We've had this talk a million times. Without too many words it's effectively this right:

1.) Regulars/Admins should take charge and run various teams that communicate, strategize and not all sit in one super-team or play only heavy 1-man assets to get some kills.

2.) Heavy assets are there for support. Infantry squads are there to spearhead and capture flags. Heavy assets stay behind the lines in support of infantry.

3.) APC's are not offensive weapons but troop transports and fire-support. 

4.) CAS should be waiting at the base and get called in for support not just blow everything up and clear the road so infantry simply walks from flag to flag without any engagements.

5.) Any form of base-raping / camping should be 'frowned upon' or punished. 

That's about it right? 

Personally I can only see the fun in playing like that and teaching our blueberries/randoms to play like that. Practically I have been told a million times not gonna work, not gonna happen. 

However in light with Double his recent suggestion for an weekly event day perhaps we can more or less volunteer and try it? 

We can name it Saturday hard-core rules or something.

[Spartanish]

And drama of camping heavy assets continues, despite the fact that we have those on like 20-25% of layouts? Which leaves another 70% of maps without it on which we could play more often with 30tish-40 player server. Too bad then that we have to play Khami STD for example, cause somebody wanted to play with CAS and nuke everything trying to get to the bridge. 

How about to rather prioritize making sure we are playing already existing harder maps, instead of making the one with full loads of assets more "challenging".

And this farce regarding  'baserape'. Quite a shame that out of all your examples, only in like Beirut, Bamyan and Bijar the heavy lands assets might actually shooting 'past' second flag (and such thing happens on bijar only when admins/Tank sq leader forgets to force all those skipping city for caves from doing so). Not gonna comment CAS (Beirut Havoc most OP as always) since their operation limit seems to be never fully  designated. Some says it's also two flags, other says it's first enemy flag (Saarema Cobra push to Kuuresare) and for the rest everything apart from main base (Kashan/Khami CAS rush for vehicles leaving base).

You said it yourself, "Project Reality". Well what a surprise, heavy armor assets are actually 'camping' in real life instead of pushing like crazy into cities or forests which are killzones for them. You want to force them from doing so, which leaves with only one alternative, pushing forward and getting quickly damaged/destroyed. Unless somebody provides full time logi support, which as we know is as rare as certain Dutchman not being bored. There are some players who are doing that but even they prefer to play with something else on big maps since well, logi gameplay is more or less boring. You said you got bored of camping on hills, well I for example got bored of logi gameplay on desert maps.

[=VG= Kavelenko]

Ok just to be clear Double. This map is the COOP Alt map for Kashan Desert its similar to the large, and standard versions of Kashan. but I'll still be able to get my point across.

When the game starts North Village, North Bunker and South Bunker are neutral so they are all cappable, therefore we are allowed to capture them, and we are also allowed to shoot at any vehicle that is advancing on those positions. Especially if we have assets at those locations. Regardless of whether we do, those flags are not owned by the bots (yet) so anything coming towards those positions and firing on our team is fair game. That includes South Bunker where we could have a tank or logi truck camped. We're allowed to protect those flags, this is not base rape. Base rape is going past that green line and shooting at tanks, jets, helis BEFORE South Bunker is captured. As far as I'm concerned any tank or vehicle that has arrived at South Bunker is fair game and we are not blocking or destroying enemy re-inforcement routes, (no razor wire, no mines, etc). Once North Village is taken how does a tank sitting on the hills over-looking North and South Bunkers and shooting at armour coming from North Outpost or the Main base constitute base rape? According to the rules we could even have a squad or CAS taking out the armour spawning at Outpost, its within the rules if its strategic.

Yes we know that if the tank kills all the armour coming towards South Bunker it may ruin the fun of the infantry squad sitting there but its not against the rules. And why should camping be illegal, that's not against the rules either. Snipers do it, that's their job. I'm all for infantry squads having fun too but shouldn't you run the infantry version of Kashan Desert if that's the case, why turn a heavy asset based map into an infantry one? That's why Kashan Desert and Khamisiyah are designed the way they are, they're heavy assets maps. Boom, bang, CAS overhead, and the smell of cordite and all that jazz....Jeees leave our heavy assets maps as they are, PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEZE.

[Double_13]

maybe you forgetting the flag in the left top where that would be the next flag as indicated by the lines so only assets from that direction are comming from a push 1 flag ahead situation

[=VG= Kavelenko]

You mean North Outpost? Technically we can attack North Outpost once North Village is captured, ok if you're splitting hairs then its when North Bunker is captured, but it doesn't fly that we cannot shoot at and kill any armour coming from Outpost while we are attempting to capture North Bunker. Or do we just stand there like protestors and wave peace flags?

 

[Double_13]

Yes kav i know kashan is a pain in the ass with the rules relating to camping but make one of your amazing drawing on Kozalsk ALT and explain to my why the MILITIA BMP+TANK+SPG can camp at H9KP7 before vehicle or chemical are capped.

and while you at it also explain to me why on silent eagle tanks push to H6kp2 and shoot down ALL the armour before the logging house is capped. I think the rules says you can skip 1 flag but not that you can skip one then camp on the edge of the 3th one.

 

LIKE said and its kinda sad that the same maps are always mentioned for counter proof. The fact we have to draw this out and debate it should say enough how the map is played. 
I suggest the topic goes back to the short play times on the maps. that they might be caused by camping people or flaws is for something else. 

 

Lets hope that the next update will fix the bot spawning and that they might again spawn on the front flags so people dont need to skip flags and we can all forget about how it is currently done. 

 

PS for spartanish. If you see a A10 or F15 flying over KHAMI main it does not mean they might be fireing. I follow the same policy as ted to only attack targets on the NORTH side of the bridge when the city is capable. If other fellow cas pilots do the same IDK. 

[=VG= Kavelenko]

Well I could but I won't because you haven't answered my questions regarding Kashan Desert, that is one of the maps you accused regulars/admins of camping and base raping was it not?

Sure if people break the rules then fair enough warn or punish them but sitting on a hill over-looking North and South Bunker is not base rape.

It might not suit the purists but unless the rules are changed we can't stop that, in my opinion.

[ranger_12]

12 hours ago, Jersans said:

Here we go again. We've had this talk a million times. Without too many words it's effectively this right:

1.) Regulars/Admins should take charge and run various teams that communicate, strategize and not all sit in one super-team or play only heavy 1-man assets to get some kills.

2.) Heavy assets are there for support. Infantry squads are there to spearhead and capture flags. Heavy assets stay behind the lines in support of infantry.

3.) APC's are not offensive weapons but troop transports and fire-support. 

4.) CAS should be waiting at the base and get called in for support not just blow everything up and clear the road so infantry simply walks from flag to flag without any engagements.

5.) Any form of base-raping / camping should be 'frowned upon' or punished. 

That's about it right? 

Personally I can only see the fun in playing like that and teaching our blueberries/randoms to play like that. Practically I have been told a million times not gonna work, not gonna happen. 

However in light with Double his recent suggestion for an weekly event day perhaps we can more or less volunteer and try it? 

We can name it Saturday hard-core rules or something.

i completly agree with what you said  Jersans

[ranger_12]

10 hours ago, Spartanish said:

And drama of camping heavy assets continues, despite the fact that we have those on like 20-25% of layouts? Which leaves another 70% of maps without it on which we could play more often with 30tish-40 player server. Too bad then that we have to play Khami STD for example, cause somebody wanted to play with CAS and nuke everything trying to get to the bridge. 

How about to rather prioritize making sure we are playing already existing harder maps, instead of making the one with full loads of assets more "challenging".

And this farce regarding  'baserape'. Quite a shame that out of all your examples, only in like Beirut, Bamyan and Bijar the heavy lands assets might actually shooting 'past' second flag (and such thing happens on bijar only when admins/Tank sq leader forgets to force all those skipping city for caves from doing so). Not gonna comment CAS (Beirut Havoc most OP as always) since their operation limit seems to be never fully  designated. Some says it's also two flags, other says it's first enemy flag (Saarema Cobra push to Kuuresare) and for the rest everything apart from main base (Kashan/Khami CAS rush for vehicles leaving base).

You said it yourself, "Project Reality". Well what a surprise, heavy armor assets are actually 'camping' in real life instead of pushing like crazy into cities or forests which are killzones for them. You want to force them from doing so, which leaves with only one alternative, pushing forward and getting quickly damaged/destroyed. Unless somebody provides full time logi support, which as we know is as rare as certain Dutchman not being bored. There are some players who are doing that but even they prefer to play with something else on big maps since well, logi gameplay is more or less boring. You said you got bored of camping on hills, well I for example got bored of logi gameplay on desert maps.

camping behind INF spartanish not near the last flag. u got wrong idea i think

[ranger_12]

10 hours ago, Spartanish said:

which as we know is as rare as certain Dutchman not being bored. There are some players who are doing that but even they prefer to play with something else on big maps since well, logi gameplay is more or less boring. You said you got bored of camping on hills, well I for example got bored of logi gameplay on desert maps.

agressive words  .... not acceptable at all. since when tanks camp in real wars spartanish ???  since i was born i alwas see tanks open paths to inf. even in modern wars tanks do support inf to flank cities. inlight me please if there is any new strategy !!  no means spartanish u know i like ya ^^

[Double_13]

If you want an answer to your question. Technically yes you suppose to stand their and not shoot as it is in violation of the rules. Practically this doesn’t work. The question then should by why you up their in the first place if you according to the rules can’t shoot. 

This is exactly why I forwarded it to a more linear map that has simmilar abuse on the map that can’t be muffled away well the bot is their and well I can’t shoot so. 

Even picking another desert map as boring sands. Is it allowed for the tank to part at the bridge (e6kp3) and shoot all the assets leaving main?. Again you skipping 1+2 neutral and 1 enemy flag but you don’t shoot in the cap. You technically not past the 2th flag and not shooting targets entering or attacking the allowed to skip to flag. The debate that if gastation is capped you technically allowed is also a rather difficult one.

Let’s say this would be allowed right let’s apply the exact same rules to mutrah. 

Docks is capped meaning I attack north city but because I can skip 1 flag I can push to mosk but rather sitting on mosk I sit on the edge of south city as technically I am attacking/defending the mosk from the enemy convoy.

sounds strange right? attacking mosk but shooting down the targets driving at south city. Even the whole idea been so far in that map. 

 

This is is probably where the confusion lays. As you say on kashan  can be on the Hill overlooking the bunkers this is your north city. Then I can attack north outpost as it is the next flag (mosk on mutrah). But rather than attacking the flag I defend just outside the main (south city) or in kashans method on the Hill. If this would be allowed I can technically park my tank 1 meter outside the main and camp their as I am not attacking it I am defending north outpost (mosk) But then from far away. 

Sounds odd right north city not even capped but already camping south city.

So the question should be what is skipping a flag and attacking the next. Does it mean I can then park my tank/apc fob or whatever. Between the 2nd and 3th flag or can I only be at the second and defend it with reasonable distance/logic 

 

I agree that kashan can’t be fixed but my Hill camping mainly focused on bamyan in where not only they skip 2 flags they also shoot empty assets in main. 

[Spartanish]

54 minutes ago, ranger_12 said:

camping behind INF spartanish not near the last flag. u got wrong idea i think

So yea, they should push first. Pretty much countless videos from Syria showing tanks getting destroyed proves indeed how excellent weapon they are when moved to direct combat on <200m distance. So silly of me to think that instead they should keep distance and make sure that terrain is clear of enemies so INF can push into city/buildings without getting rekt, and after that keep following and covering main streets. Nah, better push right into flag, between 7 spawn points and expect INF to cover most of them. And regarding no offence Ranger, maby that's one of the reasons why arabs lost every war with Israel despite having such numerical advantage every single time.

 

But now back to topic since I went too much off it. It occurs to me Double that either you are extremely (un)lucky to have such situations happening often or you are trully overestimating this problem. I might not be playing as much as I used to but I am almost never a witness to such situations you mention apart from CAS deep strikes on Kashan, Khami or Muttrah. Hill camping does occur on Bamyan but face it, last four flags there are like 100m from eath other? On certain parts of Gas Station there you can see vehicles just leaving main. By forcing them out off hills you're gonna reduce problem a bit but by no means resolve it. Also most players there don't engage targets in main to begin with.

And back to Ragnarok topic. For you maby prolonged, intense round is more fun. Some others though might found them anoying and only have fun when things go fast and smoothly. Tried once Battle of la Drang with 40 people. Did they found it fun and challenging? Nope, they were only frustrated and tired of it after 40 min. 

I trully believe that instead of making overplayed maps harder, there should be bigger emphasis on checking and changing next maps on harder maps which are underused due to their difficulty on low-med pop and lack of recognition among admins/players. Like for example at this moment there is Burning Sands being played with 35 players, 5 of them being admins. Kinda overkill but well, seems no one thought on time to switch for something more challenging. Not gonna pretend that I would do better since I rather prefer to leave it for others but it further proves that admins should give bigger considiration towards this particular matter.

[=VG= Kavelenko]

2 hours ago, =VG= Kavelenko said:

When the game starts North Village, North Bunker and South Bunker are neutral so they are all cappable, therefore we are allowed to capture them, and we are also allowed to shoot at any vehicle that is advancing on those positions.

I should clarify this statement because it might be interpreted wrongly. Looking at the map the sequence of flag capture should be North Village must be captured first. Pretty sure the North and South Bunker's become cappable once North Village is taken BUT once that happens, then North and South Bunkers become cappable at the same time. So according to the rules about how many flags we are allowed to skip, there is nothing to stop a squad being flown in to either South Bunker or North Bunker and waiting for North Village to be capped. 

A competent squad could easily hide inside a bunker until North Village was capped and even setup defences assets such as AA & TOW and THEN take down the armor which you are forced to do in order to cap South Bunker. But with the 1 flag skip rule a squad is still entitled to be there even if north Village is not yet capped. They only need to fall back if North Village is not able to be capped.

[=VG= SemlerPDX]

9 hours ago, =VG= Kavelenko said:

some players just want to fly something and blow something else up or rack up kills for cheap thrills. So what? Leave em alone I say, if they're having fun why not?

3 hours ago, =VG= Kavelenko said:

why turn a heavy asset based map into an infantry one? That's why Kashan Desert and Khamisiyah are designed the way they are, they're heavy assets maps. Boom, bang, CAS overhead, and the smell of cordite and all that jazz....Jeees leave our heavy assets maps as they are,

3 hours ago, Spartanish said:

How about to rather prioritize making sure we are playing already existing harder maps, instead of making the one with full loads of assets more "challenging".

25 minutes ago, Spartanish said:

instead of making overplayed maps harder, there should be bigger emphasis on checking and changing next maps on harder maps which are underused due to their difficulty on low-med pop and lack of recognition among admins/players.

7 hours ago, =VG= Double_13 said:

failures of the maps that the bots are only able to spawn in main

1 hour ago, =VG= Double_13 said:

Between the 2nd and 3th flag

 

Winner Winner Chicken Dinner
 

[Double_13]

 

24 minutes ago, =VG= SemlerPDX said:

Winner Winner Chicken Dinner

 

[Ragnarok1775]

Speaking of a police state, can't we all just get along?

Yeah we could wait a couple minutes and let the bots take some ground to level the playing field, but that's counting on 30-40 people agreeing on something which will never happen.

When I lead tanks we do use the one mans, I try to get the maximum number of tanks in the field and split up to cover different areas and support the various grunt squads instead of blitzkrieging flag after flag.

I saw on here or the PR forums where someone talked about numbers of tickets, would that help any? Or we would just blitzkrieg the map and sit outside their uncappable main and bleed them?

Last night we had a good round on Pavlovsk which is definitely a challenging map (lesson learned, US should stay out of Russian affairs). We were outnumbered and we did get wiped a few times, but we didn't cap the entire map, and it is a bit disappointing when we win simply through ticket bleeding, like a boxing match won by judge's decision rather than a knock out.