[poll] Arma 2 Event - Saturday April 21st

[lupago]

Next time we should just meet in clafghan or something like that to plan everything in the main base

[Pvt. Pirate]

SavageCDN =VG= LAN_WROTE ...

Pvt. Pirate LAN_WROTE ...
maybe just plan the event weeks ahead and have people sign in for the event and know their teams and objectives already before everything starts. also make the eventserver password protected, so noone joins late or uninvited. that might make everything a bit smoother.

Well we weren't really set on one mission so that is hard to do. Also since this was our first event I didn't want anything too serious or rigid as I think that scares off a lot of new players or those that don't play MP often. I do understand what you are saying though and I think as we get more events under our belt it will become more 'disciplined'. We will also discuss password-protecting the server for future events (also forces players on TS which is a bonus).

lupago =VG= LAN_WROTE ...

Great rounds, as i said i am going to be more active in ArmA II, i wish we can keep doing something like this every weekend. Think one of the best tonight was the one with the German army and the lost supplies!

Well they do require a bit of work/planning and my wife will actually kill me if I do this every weekend!! That being said if there are members who want to help out in the setup and testing they are more than welcome!!

Yes that 20 player mission was actually well done (despite the night/day issue) I'd like to try that one again at some point.

Airborne and Pirate - good posts I didn't quote it but I'm thinking along the same lines. The organization/squad tactics/etc will come over time. Your other points are noted and will be up for discussion as well. I would like as much input as possible as to what members want for these events so keep it coming (we must get Pirate a copy of OA!!).

Speirs =VG= LAN_WROTE ...

- Less or no communication between squads
- Not much tactical movement as squad
- No warmup-round / basic-training for beginners
- No multiplayer mission with objectives and end
- Endless Insurgency, boring
- No ACRE/ACE mod

Suggestion for the next event:

- Missions
- Predefined squads with task distribution
- Communication on the battlefield!
- Tactical movement on urban terrain
- Training before event

Good points Speirs. We actually did start with missions but so many people showed up we had to switch to Insurgency. I also like your idea of having training sessions before the event (like an hour or two before) - we can easily make a 'training' map where new players can break shit and not get chewed out !yes

well, we had events of similiar playercounts in "vietcong- Fist Alpha" and it was always much work for the admins to organize those.

having a main base for the briefing and preparing the teams/squads would be great.
for big events its always important to only have players who are willing to cooperate and communicate, so handing out the Password gives that there are only those palyers on the server.
having a password is definitely not needed for general training.

also i understand you cant be building a new mission every week !hi

[Sam]

yeah , thanks Savage to organize this event and more...

[=VG= Murderface0151]

i really think we should head towards a structured battlefield setup. dont just stay in the realm of "do what you want" kind of thing... but head for structured, organised, military precision with a main battle plan. get some industrial killing going, and also advance leadership skills of some players, and overall team play. we can really be on top form and efficient as possible this way..

[Terremer]

i think the lack of organization was due to having a large amount of random players in the server. if we have a large enough turnout to where we can close the server to our community, i think that we could organize much easier. at the same time, leaving the server open could show some new/other players how we roll and they might turn out to be regular players on the server. i think that if we want a highly structured and planned game we would have to plan in advance and likely lock the server. having large open events is still fun though since theres just so many players on the server.

[Pvt. Pirate]

hehe, what you are talking about, terremer, is what we called "rambo-catching". we chose a vanilla mission and leave the server open. thats fine sometimes, but doesnt work on a "special event". after having had some trainign events and a special, we should for sure make some open events for everyone free to join and catch some ramboes ;)

[=VG= SavageCDN (Inactive Duty)]

Just reviewing the posts.. here are the comments from Saturday's event:


Forgot to say thanks to Poffadder for attempting to create some sort of order amidst the chaos, and to Semler for providing transportation and bouncing services.

• No pre-event training or support for those new to the game

• Too many pubbies / idiots / people without mics

• Lack of co-ordination re: squads / objectives / tactics

• Mission type (Insurgency) - no 'ending' want clear objectives to complete

• No mods / ACRE/ ACE

The mass pubbies were a positive in some respects.. good to see our Insurgency server full again. I think we can have different types of events.. ones that are locked and for VG members/friends only, and ones that are open to the public where perhaps VG members can play key roles (transport pilot, CAS, FOB setups, etc), while the masses join up and do some ground pounding.

It seems that locking the server for most events is a good idea. I'd like to have it so that if pubbies join the TS3 server then fine we will give them the password. It will say in the server browser something like Join TS3 for password.

I think with a more co-ordinated effort and specific missions (not open-ended ones like Domi or Ins) it will improve. The squad tactics, etc will come over time.. not too worried about this (Speirs you volunteering to lead the CQB training? lol)

As for mods we discussed having the first (few??) event(s) as vanilla Arma 2 CO without requiring any addons as mods can be confusing for new players (and old ones for that matter).


Anyone else have anything to add?

[=VG= Murderface0151]

that sounds good haha

[Guest AirborneAlways]

For those wanting order from chaos, Dslyecxi did a good guide for ARMA 2 which most (if not all) is still usable for Combined Operations.

http://ttp2.dslyecxi.com/

This guide was designed with Milsim Realism in mind without going to the HARDCORE milsim. This will give those who are unfamiliar with tactics something to read over.

[=VG= Murderface0151]

i have flicked through his write up once or twice in my time as an Arma 2 Player, some very good information there and not enough can be said about that type of information in one write up. we should take heed

[=VG= Calv]

Apologies for not being at the event, other stuff came up.

Looking at the comments most of the "issues" seem to be stuff that is expected at a first event.
Things like command structure, organised teams, squads etc will all be easy to implement once everyone is comfortable turning up on time and has arma and ts working correctly.

If you're going to be running missions I would suggest the creation of a "training/warmup" mission. Something simple like a HQ, weapon crates, and shooting range dropped someplace in the desert is enough. Just allows everyone to join, get setup, and discuss/sort out any issues, and blow off some steam before the more "serious" missions begin.

Could also be worth considering having two separate arma days. One with vanilla where everyone can slot in whether they want and relax a bit, and an ace/acre sessions with pre-set fireteams and a more organised, serious tone.

For the vanilla stuff the main thing is gonna be comms discipline. Pretty easy to manage though, everyone sticks to in-game Group VON, then reserve TS for FTLs/command to communicate.
Second thing would be buddy teams. Simple concept that helps keep everyone alive and together.

For the more serious possible ace/acre stuff:

Establish a set roster based on who is turning up each session and split everyone into 4 man fireteams, throw experienced or eager players into the FTL roles, and depending on the mission/number of players maybe a squad leader/command player to keep people organised.

Would advise to focus mainly on infantry to begin with until a few fireteams are running and effective, with some basic fireteam knowledge such as where to stand in a line, column, wedge formation, what sectors to cover when in formation or standing still, buddy teams, how to bound.

Once you've got some fireteams formed I'm happy and available most times to help teach them the basics, it's a bit more difficult without SThud but doable.

[=VG= SavageCDN (Inactive Duty)]

AirborneAlways LAN_WROTE ...

For those wanting order from chaos, Dslyecxi did a good guide for ARMA 2 which most (if not all) is still usable for Combined Operations.

http://ttp2.dslyecxi.com/

This guide was designed with Milsim Realism in mind without going to the HARDCORE milsim. This will give those who are unfamiliar with tactics something to read over.

Yes excellent guide... read it when I first got into Arma but I should read it again.

Calv LAN_WROTE ...

Apologies for not being at the event, other stuff came up.

Looking at the comments most of the "issues" seem to be stuff that is expected at a first event.
Things like command structure, organised teams, squads etc will all be easy to implement once everyone is comfortable turning up on time and has arma and ts working correctly.

If you're going to be running missions I would suggest the creation of a "training/warmup" mission. Something simple like a HQ, weapon crates, and shooting range dropped someplace in the desert is enough. Just allows everyone to join, get setup, and discuss/sort out any issues, and blow off some steam before the more "serious" missions begin.

Once a set roster is established and there is a good idea of who is turning up each session it's easy enough to split everyone into 4 man fireteams, throw experienced or eager players into the FTL roles, and depending on the mission/number of players maybe a squad leader/command player to keep people organised.

Would advise to focus mainly on infantry to begin with until a few fireteams are running and effective, with some basic fireteam knowledge such as where to stand in a line, column, wedge formation, what sectors to cover when in formation or standing still, buddy teams, how to bound.

With vanilla arma it is also going to be necessary to push comms discipline on people very early. Pretty easy to manage though, everyone sticks to in-game Group VON, then reserve TS for FTLs/command to communicate.

Once you've got some fireteams formed I'm happy and available most times to help teach them the basics, it's a bit more difficult without SThud but doable.

Could also be worth considering having two separate arma days. One with vanilla where everyone can slot in whether they want and relax a bit, and an ace/acre sessions with pre-set fireteams and a more organised, serious tone.

No worries Calv.. thanks for your post it is good to have some input from someone who has experience in these types of events. I agree with your points about a more structured roster and as mentioned I think that will come over time.

Training mission is a definite must.. a few people have mentioned it and if I had more time I would have whipped something up. I'd love to do ACE/ACRE versions as well but I have little to no experience in mission making for ACE.

As we saw on Saturday a comms structure is a necessity and as you mentioned having a combo of TS/VON should do the trick. Also having all players on the TS server will be a big plus.

[Guest AirborneAlways]

[quote]

AirborneAlways LAN_WROTE ...

For those wanting order from chaos, Dslyecxi did a good guide for ARMA 2 which most (if not all) is still usable for Combined Operations.

http://ttp2.dslyecxi.com/

This guide was designed with Milsim Realism in mind without going to the HARDCORE milsim. This will give those who are unfamiliar with tactics something to read over.

Yes excellent guide... read it when I first got into Arma but I should read it again.


yeah good info, I was introduced to that guide a couple of years ago when I started into Tactical Realism Units (hardcore styled units/clans). Not going back to that (LOL) cause the GF doesn't like how much time that can eat up.

[=VG= Calv]

LAN_WROTE ...

Training mission is a definite must.. a few people have mentioned it and if I had more time I would have whipped something up. I'd love to do ACE/ACRE versions as well but I have little to no experience in mission making for ACE.

It's no different really. I've just started mission making and finished my 3rd mission, all with ace/acre stuff, plus some other mods like the EOD mod. In the editor the only module you have to add to the mission is the ACE wound system if you want the full healing options. Everything else just works.

For a training area ace/acre adds a large selection of ammo boxes to the unit list, so can literally just dump down an acre radio box, US weapons box and US launchers box and ya set.

ACRE automatically replaces any standard radio with a 343, so for standard missions if everyone is gonna be within a few hundred metres of each other they'll be fine, usually only have to add 148s to maybe the ftls/command and you add them just like any other item, classnames can be found on the acre website.

With ace missions you may want to add earplugs, morphine and epi to each player but that's easy enough as well, can find all the ace classlists here: http://wiki.ace-mod.net/Classlists

[=VG= Murderface0151]

VON/TS combo seems a very sound idea indeed, should avoid a lot of confusion and help keep comms to a minimum. if i can get my mic working correctly i'd love to put myself forward for an FTL role lol. actually got some experience behind me in this game these days lol, not sure if it's =VG+ tags only for those kind of things though, which would make sense.

[=VG= Calv]

SavageCDN =VG= LAN_WROTE ...

Training mission is a definite must.. a few people have mentioned it and if I had more time I would have whipped something up.

Slapped together a basic warmup/training area for ya. Has slots for 2x infantry squads (+squad leader and medic each) and a commander, so 21 slots total.
Has respawn on but no idea about join in progress so ya may need to mess with it a bit. Put everything into a .rar so ya can make any needed changes before using it.
vg_trainingarea.zargabad.rar

[=VG= SavageCDN (Inactive Duty)]

wow thanks calv.. I've been using the F2 framework to create missions which has a JIP component and also uses standard group IDs and markers (I think it follows the ShacTac group IDs) so I can easily add this stuff.


@Murder - yes please do.. we need good SLs who can communicate over TS/VON.. don't care if you have tags or not my friend !declare

[=VG= Murderface0151]

awesome, thanks Savage. i'll try and sort TS3/Mic issue. if i can not fix it calmly i will punch it so hard i will kill it's entire family lol.

but seriously i've started to play a bit of OA recently and tactical decisions are coming naturally... it's looking good :) can't wait for the next meet so we can discuss this shit! :D

[=VG= SavageCDN (Inactive Duty)]

Well we don't have to wait until the next event to discuss.. I'm not a very good SL myself (more of a strategic thinker than a tactical one)... so I'll need to rely on other members to take up the slack.. besides I don't want to do any leading if I've made or helped make the mission as I'll already know all the tricks.

[=VG= Calv]

As FTL your main job is of course commanding the three other people in your team. This means that you need to know the general abilities of the people in your team. In an experienced team, very few orders will need to be given as they will know how to move and flank etc, however for newer people you will need to be more aware of what they are doing and provide more specific instructions, even upto telling them what cover to use and how far to move to the next cover etc. FTL is probably the only "command" role where micro-managing is not a bad thing.

A key tool for fireteams that makes FTL's jobs easier is the Buddy team system. Simply put you split your fireteam into 2x two man teams. We typically refer to them as alpha and bravo but anything will work as long as the team members understand. Usually each fireteam will have at least one experienced member who can be the lead for the bravo buddy team, while the ftl takes lead of alpha team.
This system provides two benefits, firstly it allows you to not worry too much about any newer players as they can just be told to follow their buddy and point their gun in the opposite direction. If their buddy is looking left, they look right etc.
Secondly, it gives you flexibility needed for bounding and flanking maneuvers.

Bounding: Simple concept that will keep your team alive. It can be applied on a squad, fireteam or buddy level depending on the situation. Basically one element covers a sector where enemies are expected while the other element moves, then they swap roles.
There are many variables that can alter the way it is performed, whether you're advancing/retreating, the enemy is engaged and one element is suppressing/no enemies spotted but the core idea is the same.
So even when working as an individual fireteam you will want to apply bounding when moving through areas where you expect enemies to be, especially urban environments that have lots of corners and blind spots.

Another task of the FTL is to relay information to his team. This isn't as big of an issue in vanilla arma as everyone is gonna hear everything anyway, but it's good practice especially if acre is going to be introduced eventually.
Team members don't like being in the dark about what they're going to do and what everyone else is doing, so keeping them updated on basic information like where the other teams are, where you plan to move to and what you plan to do are all very good for keeping the engaged and switched on. It's also extremely helpful for when you take a bullet, rather than your team being left directionless they will have a general idea of where to go and what to do.

There are other things that are helpful such as how formations are setup, who stands where, what direction they cover, what to do when something starts firing in your direction, to always move after firing etc but those things are often common sense and can be picked up as you play. Generally just telling them to cover the opposite direction to their buddy is enough and hit the deck and get to cover when a shot is heard, is enough.

One final tip that I'm starting to adopt is: Don't rush. Speed and momentum are vital for staying alive, but too many people want to kill every enemy within the first minute of a firefight that they start rushing and stop thinking. Basic tools such as smoke grenades and underbarrel GLs and even communication get forgotten in the heat of battle. Staying behind cover and assessing the general area then having one buddy team employing suppression fire, smoke and explosives while the other moves to flanking cover will generally keep everyone alive.

[=VG= Murderface0151]

some very good techniques and ideas there Calv, the buddy system sounds very useful aswell, and i guess when the FTL takes a round to the mug then the Bravo Fireteam leader can act as a 2IC and take momentary command also.

i'd consider most of what you said common sense, but that's only from amassing around 600 hours of total Arma play time between Arma 2 and OA. your post should help new guys out a lot and also make our job easier.

mad props mate, Murder.

[Terremer]

i personally need to work on moving slower and using more tactics, ive played the majority of my hours on arma either solo or with 1 or 2 people where we either snipe or rambo it into the town. it's fun but not great for widescale operations.

[Guest AirborneAlways]

Having done:

Fire Team Lead (E-3 to E-4)
Squad Leader(CPL)
Platoon Leader (LT1-LT2)

within the realm of ARMA, I will lend my knowledge to those who wish to lead (have almost 2 years in the tactical realism virtual world and a SMALL bit of real world). I am not wanting to returm to being in lead positions at this time as the girlfriend is happy that I found Veterans-Gaming.

(I will take flying lessons from Bludklot in BMS before returning to TRU just to keep the girlfriend happy)

[=VG= Murderface0151]

nice credentials there Airborne :) respect is due.

perhaps a Roster should be put together? :P

[chrisi123]

i was think aboout giving every squad a name like alpha21 or viper9 and stuff. this would be a lot funnier than it is. cause you have to say: alpha 21 this is ironhawk, how copy? ironhawk this is alpha 21 yeah we read you lima charlie, be prepared for hotel tango sierra, over :)