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Flashbacks pt.2


=VG= Skitalez

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I don't know what happened to the behavior of bots after the last big update, but it's safe to say that for the worse. Almost every map is easy to win. If earlier on the Kozelsk ALT we sat on the "objective Boris" for 1-2 hours, afraid to stick out of the hell hole, or on the Fallujah West we fought bloody massacres for the basement in the hospital, now it's just spit. Is there any way to restore the old settings in the behavior of bots? I'm sorry, I'm not a programmer and I think it's not so easy, but guys, now the action is only possible at some stage of Tad Sae or Charlies Point. Its sad. 😔😭

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I can totally relate to what Skitalez says.

Nowadays, you can finish Muttrah Standard with 8 players.
Korengal Valley with about 15 players (back in the day, that map was a nightmare).
Almost beat Jabal with three people (ran out of time and tickets; ask X0R and/or Alucard).

Knowing that we share the same play style, I feel like I'm lost as well.

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Yeah,a certain someone nerfed bots trying out a new config & weapon temperatures, only way to even get close to how they were with out changing configs is to Max out bot difficulty, reduce bot respawn time by 1/2 to balance their frailty & bias flag polarity on start (bots own all neutral cp's on round start) , especially on muttrah, it truly is boring now.

 

Cos unsurprisingly, maps are only truly fun nowadays with very few people, 3 man jabal with euro & aluc was epic though surprisingly easy, almost ran their tickets dry, mostly having had less than 10 tickets #funTimes

 

@=VG= Vanillapop bot numbers are unchanged afaik, though logical bot count or avg number of bots alive through a round is lower, by virtue of being less formidable to kill, hence your impression perhaps

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Half of it is bots being gay, we can change some values around like the old days though. Longer AA range, Longer RPGs and shorter fire times, as well as shooting at helis. Other things, like where the bots spawn just gets changed when we update maps and stuff.

Other half is players knowing the tactics better, everyone knows exactly where to sit, where the bots spawn and come from and how to win the map as fast as possible. You could win maps super fast in the old days if you had a good team too,

If that's not a good enough answer, just play shahadah everytime

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5 hours ago, Connor said:

I like all of that except longer AA range, no thank veri much

Longer AA range with less accuracy is not bad you know? better than 5000% accuracy . this days even if someone laze shilka for you and you are 600 alt you drop the bomb but you get shot down by that shilka while your bomb is on the way. (that's i don't like)  Not sure thought if its accuracy or our assets have less health damage. 

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2 hours ago, ranger_12 said:

Longer AA range with less accuracy is not bad you know? better than 5000% accuracy . this days even if someone laze shilka for you and you are 600 alt you drop the bomb but you get shot down by that shilka while your bomb is on the way. (that's i don't like)  Not sure thought if its accuracy or our assets have less health damage. 

Yeah of course that would be nice but like you said, the Shilka still snipes you from 600alt... And melon never mentioned less accuracy :((( So shilka + Lazer Aim + Extra Range..... no no no no

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On 11/25/2020 at 2:37 AM, =VG= Skitalez said:

I don't know what happened to the behavior of bots after the last big update, but it's safe to say that for the worse.

Skit, I think its too easy when the server is full for sure but I play a lot when the server is below 10, even with 20 players they sometimes struggle on a map like Fallujah, so it depends on who's on and the numbers IMO.

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1 hour ago, X0R said:
4 hours ago, GRNANDGLD said:

Is there a way to randomize bot spwans??

Yes. Without modifying maps? Also Yes.

Why then isn't it a thing? IDFK, Code exists :beee:

I don't know if you mean randomize which spawn the bots appear on or if we need to add more. The first already happens and for when the bot spawnpoints are added there are 2 things to do

1 make sure the spawn is out of cap zone but also not so far away they are spawning in another zone

2. Try and make it so that the bots spawn outside of line of sight when you are inside capzone to prevent camping them.

Some maps it is because of the map itself that I don't have more. not many places to hide a spawn in a desert for example. Otherwise it is because of the way the map itself works that limits spawns

I try to put around 10 spawn points to each flag

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2 hours ago, =VG= Melon Muncher said:

I don't know if you mean randomize which spawn the bots appear on or if we need to add more. The first already happens and for when the bot spawnpoints are added there are 2 things to do

 

I think he means that the bots on one certain flag dont spawn on the exact same three spots but rather in a designated area around the three spawn spots.

Example: Pavlovsk bay, Construction site, house of pain. Bots all spawn in the exact same spot on the second floor of that building --> Volod lies there and kills them all

Now make them spawn everywhere in a 10m radius around this spot, and you will have them spawning everywhere in this building --> Volod has to run around and possibly would get rekt and needs dependable team mates and communication to cover the spawn.

This makes the game more unpredictable and you have to adapt every single time you play this map.

If something like that would be possible to program, it would be awesome.

I'd donate a lot of money to this server just to see this and I am a rather poor person.

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13 hours ago, =VG= Melon Muncher said:

I don't know if you mean randomize which spawn the bots appear on or if we need to add more. The first already happens and for when the bot spawnpoints are added there are 2 things to do

1 make sure the spawn is out of cap zone but also not so far away they are spawning in another zone

2. Try and make it so that the bots spawn outside of line of sight when you are inside capzone to prevent camping them.

Some maps it is because of the map itself that I don't have more. not many places to hide a spawn in a desert for example. Otherwise it is because of the way the map itself works that limits spawns

I try to put around 10 spawn points to each flag

I meant the later, scripted solutionsl use logically enumerated spawn points using bot movement data to ensure spawn remains in navmesh & in range of a relevant (cappable) cp, for instance. 

 

Mapper placed spawn pool for 'randomised' spawn selection is simply too small in scope & doesn't apply to static objects or vehicles...so mehhh

 

It does make sense too conceal spawn points from LOS when there's a limited number of them, but less so when it's Randomised every few minutes..

 

*And what Johnny said...

Edit: ftr,I submitted code for this 3years ago, it was rejected because #reasons

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It's possible to change pretty much everything, from the spawn locations to moving flags and strategic areas, server side. Only thing stopping it is the infamous PR server licence. We have had some lenience in the past when the licence wasn't so strict like it is now & having 2 R-Devs in the clan, so we did test out things some years ago like having 1/3 of the bots skipping the flags on muttrah and rushing docks instead, IFVs shooting jets & sniping tanks with ATGMs, bot inf using smoke and grenadiers firing IR smoke at armour etc. I mean, if we had free hands to do things, then holy whacko, the amount of changes one could do to a map. Hell, just moving the mortars alone can cause havoc for unprepeared team.

Meeellloonnn, convince Mineral to give us the freedom to do things plssssssss. No one cares about COOP anyways, as they all say on the PR Forums.

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Changes to weapon ranges for AI

Grenage launcher min range 120 -> 50

LAT  Max range 180 -> 280 

Aimpoint Rifle max range 250 -> 300

Ironsights Max Range 200 -> 280 + increase deviation

Scoped Rifle max 350 -> 400 + Decreased deviation

SMG max range 100 -> 1808 + increase deviation

RPG max range 240 -> 280 + increase deviation

LMG irons max range 350 -> 450 +deviation increase

LMG scoped 450 -> 550

ZPU 4 Deviation increased

Bots no longer exit static weapons if there is no enemy present

Igla static max range 600 -> 700 

Static AT Max range 800 -> 1400

Shilka  Max range 2000 - > 1500 +deviation increased

AA Range 1100 -> 1500 to match with shilka range

APC ATGM max range increased to 800 (bots suck with mobile ATGM at long range because they will lose LOS)

APC AP max range 800 -> 1500

APC HE Max range 400 -> 1000

KPVT Max range 450 -> 800

Harrier will now get shot at same as helicopter

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4 hours ago, =VG= Melon Muncher said:

Changes to weapon ranges for AI

Grenage launcher min range 120 -> 50

LAT  Max range 180 -> 280 

Aimpoint Rifle max range 250 -> 300

Ironsights Max Range 200 -> 280 + increase deviation

Scoped Rifle max 350 -> 400 + Decreased deviation

SMG max range 100 -> 1808 + increase deviation

RPG max range 240 -> 280 + increase deviation

LMG irons max range 350 -> 450 +deviation increase

LMG scoped 450 -> 550

ZPU 4 Deviation increased

Bots no longer exit static weapons if there is no enemy present

Igla static max range 600 -> 700 

Static AT Max range 800 -> 1400

Shilka  Max range 2000 - > 1500 +deviation increased

AA Range 1100 -> 1500 to match with shilka range

APC ATGM max range increased to 800 (bots suck with mobile ATGM at long range because they will lose LOS)

APC AP max range 800 -> 1500

APC HE Max range 400 -> 1000

KPVT Max range 450 -> 800

Harrier will now get shot at same as helicopter

I like this, we need more of this
#MoreBots

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